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Old 04-25-2006   #1
Ranch Manager/Fishing Guide
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 1
Bailey Run Trespass Problem

Recently some boaters have been putting in the river downstream from Farmers Union, by jumping the fence or opening (and leaving open) gates to our pastures by the river. I'm not sure of the rationale for this, as Farmers Union has a perfectly good put in. We have no problem with boaters floating thru the ranch, we have even came up with a fence system (the orange plastic) that keeps our cattle in while allowing boaters to slide under it. Other than someone cutting down our plastic fences a few years ago, we haven't had any problems with boaters till now. Please police your ranks, and get the word out, before a few bad apples ruin this run for everyone. By the way, I think some of the yahoo's in question drive a white Toyota 4runner, Colorado plates 092-EPA. So if you see them on the river, give them an earfull. Area fishing guides have also had recent problems with boaters "playing" right on top of where thier clients are fishing in Farmers Union. Please respect the fact that some of us are trying to make a living, with cattle or as a fishing guides or whatever, and don't let your play time interfere with our livelihood. A little courtesy and respect will go along way. But the outlaw 1% has the capability of ruining it or closing it down for everyone.


John Perizzolo
Ranch Manager (and fishing guide)
Estabrook Ranch

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Old 04-25-2006   #2
pnw, Washington
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 3,404
Very sorry for the lack of respect shown to you and your property. I have not done Baileys yet but would like to in the future. I will post a link to your post on our website and help spread the word.

Anybody know who these yahoo's are?

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Old 04-25-2006   #3
Amsterdam, Netherlands
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 272
can someone out there run those plates so we can fix this? nothing like a little public persecution to clean the sh!t outa our backyard. -t
"I would drag my balls across broken glass just to hear her fart into a walkie talkie" -Jay Drury
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Old 04-25-2006   #4
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Laramie, Wyoming
Paddling Since: 1992
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 488
Let's send the Bailey Mafia goons after them, break their kneecaps. Seriously though, the landowners along the NFSP are SUPER COOL so don't piss them off! Last thing we need is a sportsmans paradise scenario on Bailey.
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Old 04-25-2006   #5
El Flaco's Avatar
Golden, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1984
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 1,879
Anyone can pull an ID from plates at the DMV for a $10 fee and a signed waiver of some sort. I'll check into it this week, since I have to register a new car anyway.

This is completely unacceptable- If you are the Yahoo that did this, I would suggested you make an apology to the Union on this Forum, and offer to come mend fences for them one Saturday.

As for boaters playing in the eddies & holes where folks are fishing....I just don't get it. As someone who's been boating for 15 years, the common respect among river users was something that was taught early in boating. William Nealy's book dedicated a section to this, and nearly every guidebook reminded us to pass quietly and give a wide berth to fishermen. It's common courtesy on rivers EVERYWHERE, not just (but especially) in areas where access is granted.

Seriously- if you can't handle this, stay in Golden Whitewater Park. Or go back to skateboarding, where it's still cool in some circles to have snotty counter-culture attitude.

John- you can trust that the majority of boaters on the Forum who appreciate the access to Bailey that you and your organization provide, and if we see someone jeopardizing one of our most coveted recreational outlets, they might get more than just an earful. Thanks for letting us know.
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Old 04-25-2006   #6
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Lakewood, Colorasta
Paddling Since: 1997
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 843
Sorry about the tresspassing issues. You guys have always been super cool about access. Thanks for taking down the barbed wire at the put in as well, you didn't have to do that. Some people are just idiots and it looks like these folk are migrating into the kayaking world. If our crew sees people doing this we'll let em know this is unacceptable.

thanks john
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Old 04-25-2006   #7
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Thought-criminal, Colorado
Paddling Since: 2000
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 989
Guaranteed, if we see that shit going down beatings will ensue. All because some lazy dipshits are too lazy to paddle some flatwater?
I hope in the future Americans are thought of as a warlike, vicious people, because I bet a lot of high schools would pick "Americans" as their mascot. -Jack Handy
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Old 04-25-2006   #8
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 43
Thanks for the heads-up John! Apologies for any problems caused. I'm not sure if you are the person I have talked with at the put-in in years past, but whoever I've talked with has always been extremely friendly and clear about the simple requests made by the ranch. Hopefully this is simply a case of some pea-brained boaters not knowing the put-in (which would be surprising given it is VERY obvious). Either way, I hope this issue will fizzle out quickly. I believe that Bailey/EstaBrook Ranch is the best model for how paddlers and fishermen can get along and enjoy the same resource.

I do have a question as a side note.... I assume that not all people fishing this stretch are with a guide? The reason I ask is I have had a couple instances (very rare) of fishermen intentionally casting right at me and verbally insulting me as I have floated by (NOT playing in their eddy). I can only assume that these are not guided clients. Without getting into the private-property legal mumbo-jumbo, I understand that paddlers are being given the opportunity to float through this stretch and use the Farmers Union put-in. But is it possible to inform fisherfolk about the good relationship we (paddlers/fishers) have here so that we are not attacked as such? Maybe this animosity can never be completely stopped.... I don't know.

Anyways.... To the paddlers/punks doing their best to screw this up, I imagine that you are in the newer generation and don't remember the nightmare at Cheeseman Canyon that developed between us paddlers and the Sportsman's Paradise folks. They had no cattle, but still enjoyed putting up potentially lethal (too big a word for you?) obstacles in the river. If you are trying to cut out flatwater, realize that we used to put in about 1/2-mile further upstream before we used the Farmers Union put-in. APPRECIATE what you have, BE RESPECTFUL (although that virtue seems to be slipping away; and not just in the paddling community) and don't f*ck it for the rest of us!

Also, save your flatwater moves until you've passed where the fishingfolk hang out. If you're that bored floating the flatwater, or can't go 100 feet without a bow-stall may I recommend the Golden Playpark!

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Old 04-25-2006   #9
BKC's Avatar
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 290
Thanks for the heads up. Much appreciated.

Yo knuckle f*ck(s) ... one word: think. I have been in communication with the couple that manages the Farmers Union and he is very interested in pursuing some community oriented kayaking events. In partnership with Bailey and us. We've got a good run within 45 minutes of Denver ... let's respect the access and other users. "Yeah ... it's that easy!"
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Old 04-25-2006   #10
Caspian's Avatar
Englewood, Colorado
Paddling Since: 1978
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 882
John - I know that virtually all of the whitewater community around here is appalled that this would happen on a run where the private landowners have always been very good to the boaters. Thank you for letting us know about this problem, you can rest assured people will keep an eye peeled. Thanks for your many years of helping us enjoy this beautiful river.

Folks - keep your play moves restricted to areas where people aren't fishing. Throwing down on an eddyline where someone is fishing is just rude. Also remember to keep the scout/portage at Four Falls short, and pick up trash from any tresspassers who may have disrespected. The landowner there is also very accomodating and only asks that we keep the time on his land short, clean, and don't pee there.

Join up, suckas.

"People demand freedom of speech to make up for the freedom of thought which they avoid."
- Soren Kierkegaard
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