Access Issues

COLDFEAR · 09-10-2005

The takeout for the upper clarks fork run in Wyoming is at a Forest Service Campground and the Forest Service has told us kayakers that we are not allowed to use the campground as a takeout, is this legal? We have tried parking outside of the campground and walking thru but they say people have complained about kayakers walking thru campsites and using the (public) restrooms. Has anybody ever heard of this happening in other areas?

If you dont takeout at the campground you have to paddle 2-3 miles of flatwater thru private land untill you hit the highway bridge.

I thought the National Forest was multiple use!

Aaron

E-Ro · 09-10-2005

Whats up aaron, I hope all is well in Cody.

Are you talking about The day stretch?

Evan

COLDFEAR · 09-11-2005

Hey Evan, I havent heard from you an awhile. Yes the day stretch is where we are having issues and the forsest services attitude here needs to change so we are trying get some data on other rivers that may have a similar put in or take out.

Have you gotten up my way at all?

The Shoshone will still be running untill mid October and it's a great class 4 play run, I'm surprised not more CO boaters come this way this time of year.

Aaron

ToddG · 09-11-2005

what up chauncey & chauncey .. i just landed in seattle & am in the process of sorting out my new life here. you guys wanna go creeking this week? oh wait, nevermind, you're in ColoWyo ...

as for your question aaron, i'd prolly need to hear more of what the ranger-goon had to say. floaters' rights vary from state-to-state, but this usually affects us with regard to private landowners .. notsomuch w/ public land. maybe it had to do with the specific use intended for that plot of land (camping). were you using the campground to park? would it have made a diff. to him if you parked outside of the CG & put in there anyway? did he threaten you with any kind of punitive action? as for other FS-land access points, you can pretty much claim most of the runs in the colorado guidebook (pretty much all of the poudre from the top down; slate & east drainage; lake cr; crystal drainage; & many others).

i bet evan.com knows a thing or two about this, seein' as how he's got the "human dimensions" of havin fun on lock (inside joke) .. ev, you out there?

hope you goons are doing well. gimme a call sometime ..

tg

RiverWrangler · 09-12-2005

Since I'm being called out here I'll give some input from my experience with the Forest Service (Circus). Basic rule here is that the Circus makes the rules... but as far as boating goes they are usually pretty lax about enforcing the rules and there is only so much trouble you can get into for using a campground as a kayaking take-out. They are usually going to give you a few warnings before they even write you a ticket. The fact though is that they CAN effectively deny access if they want to. The area managers make the rules following a management plan and if the plan doesn't include using the campground as a take-out then you basically need to petition the forest circus to add that use to the specific campground you want to use at the end of the Day Strecth. The forest service is always accepting public comments and you can find out when their managememt plan is up for review by getting in touch with your local branch.

The sad fact is that this happens all over the place. There are even some forest service managed Wild and Scenic rivers where boating is not allowed at all. 21 miles of the Chattooga Headwaters were designated Wild and Scenic recently and in the plan they decided to ban boating outright - luckily American Whitewater successfully petitioned the forest circus to remove the boating ban. One more reason to pay your AW memeber dues!

Even here on the Poudre boaters are only supposed to use certain access points and we are definetly NOT supposed use campgrounds as access areas. On the Poudre the forest service generally does not mess with you as long as you don't park in the wrong place. Issues with the forest service everywhere almost exclusively come from conflict with other users... i.e. walking through campgrounds and the campers complaining. We've had the same problem with the Narrows campground. Luckily there are plenty of other places to access the river nearby.
It might be worth contacting AW about this issue but since the circus is not really denying access so much as making you paddle a few extra miles of flat to the Painter Store (mmm pork chops) it will likely not be a high priorirty on their list. First step - go to the forest service office and put in a legitimate public comment about the access issue and then follow up by asking if there is someone you can talk to about making a way to use the campground as a take-out without disturbing the campers. Solve problems locally first if at all possible. My twelve cents (and more).
Evan.com